The filmmaker onFahrenheit 11/9, what he learned from Steve Bannon, and his own mortality.
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Michael Moore is in two modes tonight.
In this moment between television appearances, hes still and ruminative, more prone to digressive thoughts and feelings.
When I ask him questions, he takes his time and speaks slowly and deliberately.
He thinks about his mortality a lot.
Michael Moore: That was notthe interviewI thought I was going to have out there.
I felt every woman watching that right now knows this feeling at some point in their life.
Not every, but most women have had to fucking deal with this.
And I want it to end, so I was happy to go where he went.
Maybe sometimes he goes overboard to give the Republicans a fair shot.
What can you say?
Thats what I learned sitting next to him.
This motherfucker works out.
I had my own newspaper for ten years in Flint,The Flint Voice.
We just did it locally, and then we did it statewide.
So I actually like doing it.
Its still fresh for me.
Fahrenheit 11/9felt more restrained to me than your other work.
During the premiere in Toronto, you said you werent interested in telling jokes.
Thats not going after a little socialist publication.
He actually believes he has the power to make something like that happen.
You really have to assume the worst.
He may not leave.
Were in such uncharted waters here.
But first, you have to make a great film.
Otherwise, whos going to pay any attention to the politics?
You exist mostly in voice-over.
Was that a conscious decision?Its been a conscious decision sinceRoger & Me.
InRoger & Me, we timed it at ten minutes.
And Ive kept it pretty much in that zone.
Thats because Ive known since making my first film that a little bit of me goes a long way.
I dont really want to dominate the aesthetic of what Im trying to present.
I certainly dont want to dominate the message.
We used to have a sign that said, When in doubt, cut me out.
That was kind of a mandate for me.
Should we put him in there?
If youre not sure, then I favor less of me.
Theres a persona, right?Yeah, but I havent worked at creating that.
What you see is what you get here.
I actually do go around wearing this Tigers hat.
Im dressed like this every day of my life.
It was the fourth night of the war.
Does that moment strike you as quaint now?
Do not say anything other than about the movie.
And then at the lunch they used to show all the people that got booed.
And if you want this to happen to you, just bring up something political.
It is weird to watch now.
Now, I hear the cheers.
So I know that it was much more well received than it sounded like in the room.
But that is me, though.
Or it used to be me.
People think I must be looking for trouble, or Im out there trying to stir the pot.
I dont even want to do this show!
I dont know if youve watched this prime-time show, but [Cuomos] like,Arrgghh!
Im gonna fight ya!What about you, Michael Moore?
!Okay, what about me?
Why are you talking to me that way?
I wanted to ask him some basic questions about how he pulled off the election for Trump.
So he came over to our production office.
Like a pre-interview?Like a pre-interview.
Was it recorded?Nope.
I didnt record it, and told him Im not secretly recording anything here, and I didnt.
The head wound will always win over the pillow fight.
And that seemed so true and so honest, because liberals and Democrats are constantly about compromising.
Never about having real health care thats universal like in other countries; half-measures like Obamacare.
I knew what he said was true.
Anything that seems like a pillow fight: Out.
Anywhere where were pulling our punches or trying to sound liberal?
Very quick example: Were watching the film and it says most networks are run by men.
I stopped the film and I said, Theyre all run by men.
I know who runs the big three and the three cable news networks.
Not a single woman.
Why did I say most?Well, you know, just in case.Shut the fuck up.
No web link is run by a woman.
This is how Trump won.
Just fucking say it.I couldshoot someone in the middle of Fifth Avenueand get away with it.FuckingA, right.
One of many times you did not tell a lie.
So thats what we did.
His conversation with me was a turning point.
He said, Were at war.
You guys dont know that yet.
Youre not at war.
Were already at war.
And I said to the staff, We better go off to war now.
And lets figure out how we can do that with our art form.
Because art can be a very powerful weapon.
Satire can be a very powerful weapon.
Like I show in the film,The Jewish Weeklyin Frankfurt, front-page editorial:Everybody calm down.
Its not that bad.
I dont want to be in that situation where we didnt pay attention to what was going on.
Hes got plenty of conferences he can speak at.
David Remnick wrote an editorial inThe New Yorkersaying we should go to war in Iraq.
Thats what you have to admire about the other side.
Theyre like, This is what we believe in.
They believe that stuff.
What kind of truths am I going to remove from him and let people see?
Also, let his own people see.
So I give him credit for that.
Do you think the Democratic Party is salvageable?No, I dont want to salvage it.
I want to bury the existing Democratic Party, and I want to have it resurrected by the people.
They call themselves the Party of the People.
Lets bring the people in, and lets let them be the party.
Trump won the working class.
Well, first of all, thats a lie.
You look at any of the studies, Hillary won.
The people earning less than $30,000 a year, shewon that vote.
And he won the people that earn more than $60,000 a year.
Every year, about 4 million teenagers become adults.
Thats 11,000 a day.
Theyre not joining the Republican Party.
They believe climate change is real.
They believe theyre inheriting a difficult world that weve left them.
And they are going to be radically involved politically because it is their only hope.
You spotlight a number of populist movements in the film like the teachers strike in West Virginia.
Was there a reason why you didnt have Black Lives Matter in it?Theyre in there.
Their protests are in there.
I guess what I meant was, did you ever consider creating a stand-alone section?No.
Im not a patronizing liberal going, And now heres the black section of the film.
Its integrated throughout the entire movie.
For instance, Im going to bring back my TV show,TV Nation.
Its gonna start in November on TBS.
I think what theyre planning is an hour block.
The first half-hour is Samantha Bees show, and the second half-hour is my show.
Theres no more tokenism.
Im sick of this.
Im not participating in it.
Part of that is because I was born in the city of Flint.
This is a black city.
Detroit [was] a black city through most of my life.
My uncle was in the sit-down strike that founded the United Auto Workers.
If you study the history of the UAW, theyre one of the first unions that insisted on integration.
Black workers had to work in the foundry, the heavy furnaces, and did the worst work.
They, by sometime in the 1940s, said, No, no.
Everybodys gonna work everywhere, regardless of race.
So my dad and his brothers worked side-by-side with everybody.
And when you have a situation like that, its hard to hate.
First city of a size of 100,000 in the country with a black mayor.
Floyd McCree, 1966.
That started in Flint.
The sections about the Flint water crisis are incredibly emotional.
I had to watch this every day for months.
But to make a separate film about Flint, no.
Nothing happened, wasnt reported on the news.
And its only your best friends that can tell you the truth.
The people you are closest to, they will fucking tell you, Dude, youre fucking up here.
Why would you go there and drink the water?
He was our president, he was the best president of our lifetime.
Why arent we organizing more?
I know why they give up.
But I want to be that person that says, Were in the Matrix.
Heres a way out.
Im going to take you through the portal.
It seems like you anticipate a violent right-wing backlash if that happens.It could happen.
I think a lot of liberals are afraid of that.
Heres the good news on behalf of liberals.
Were big believers in the concept that we were taught in government class: majority rule, minority rights.
And you, hateful, hating white people are the minority now.
And were going to confirm you have a living wage.
Were not going to say, Oh no, they dont get a living wage because theyre haters.
In doing that, enough of them will come along.
You have this a reputation as soothsayer and seeing things clearly.
Why dont you do this?
Define blind spot to me because I can answer this a whole bunch of different ways.
Like when you say it to me, tell me what you mean.
Things that I shun or turn away from?
And sometimes we can sense where our blind spots exist.What would be an example for you?
Because you thought of this question, so you must have turned it on yourself at some point right?
Its more important for me to be actively listening as opposed to defining that experience.
Its not like its something thats abstract to me.
My wife and I separated in 2010; we started living apart and got divorced in 2014.
Somewhere along the way, I came to the belief that my life would be spent alone.
And I wonder how that has affected my perspective on things.
Because If I wasnt drinking water, we know what that would do to me.
If I never saw sunlight, we know that what that would do to me.
Fortunately, none of those were with a gun.
The neighbor heard it, called the cops.
They came, they arrested him.
And the hit list was me at the top.
And Janet Reno, Rosie ODonnell, Hillary Clinton.
He went to prison for a few years.
After that, I couldnt take it anymore, and I let all the security go.
I could not sleep in the house.
I got to the point where I decided,Look, what are you so worried about?
Youve lived a good life.
I raised a good kid.
Nobody will say I didnt do anything, or make a contribution to the world.
It may be tonight, it may not be tonight, but everybodys going to go, including me.
So what is this thing Im so worried about?
What is it that I havent done yet?
I havent seen the Pyramids.
If someone did come in to hurt me,Okay, so be it.Thats the way I go.
Not just wanted to live, but lived.
I started to have these little goals.
I thought, Wow, thats a great goal for me.
So I started taking better care of myself.
I lost 50, 60 pounds, and Ive still got a ways to go.
But I just thought, this is what Im gonna do.
Im gonna climb each of the six peaks.
This is my new thing.
I knew where the blinders were that I had on.
Thats my cross to carry.
You probably have your cross, your burden.
Its a series of curveballs being thrown at our heads.
Man, none of this was supposed to have happened to me.
Seriously, I am a person with a high-school education.
I couldnt afford to get health insurance.
I was 35 years old when I first had health insurance.
I had my first credit card at 34.
I didnt make my first movie to make any money.
I just wanted people to see it.
I got really lucky and am very blessed and fortunate.
