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My wife had to go into the city today, he says as the Joel family chopper ascends.
Life is funny, isnt it?
It didnt always used to, but now, pushing 70 years old, it does, he says.
He sips coffee from a takeout cup.
Ive got to say, things worked out.
Your old pal Elton Johnis retiring from the road.
So is Paul Simon.
Butyour Madison Square Garden residencyis booked indefinitely.
Do you understand the impulse to say, These are the last shows Ill ever do?No.
Then I just thought,nah.
Whats made you change your mind?I have the greatest job in the world.
Are you fucking kidding me?Now, I do have an idea for a farewell tour.
What is it?The stage is a living-room set: couch, TV, coffee table, food.
And theres bulletproof glass between me and the audience.
Then I come out and lay down on the couch.
I grab the remote and start watching TV.
The crowd after a couple minutes goes, Fuck this, and starts throwing shit at the glass.
And thats the whole concert?Yeah.
So if Billy Joel ever walks out on stage and picks up a remote control …Thatll be it.
What clues would signal the latter?If I cant sing as well as I should.
Weve dropped the keys of some songs already.
Hopefully its not that noticeable.
If Im having a tough time hitting notes I call it throwing junk pitches.
Instead of having a fastball you throw off-speed.
If Ive got to throw too much junk, Im going to consider stopping.
Will it be easy to walk away?Yeah.
It would be abhorrent to me to be up there faking it.
Then well do a great show and Ill read a bad review and itswhat are you talking about?
But I know when Im good or not.
There was a time when you thought your future might involve writing songs but not performing.
Is it surprising that the opposite happened?In retrospect there is an irony there.
When Istopped writing songs it was time.
I couldnt be as good as I wanted and that was driving me crazy.
I was driving my loved ones crazy.
I thought,this is ridiculous.So I stopped.But the performing, what else am I going to do?
I talked to Bruce [Springsteen] about this.
I talked to Sting and [Don] Henley: Why are you still doing it?
They all had the same answer.
Which is what?Thats what I do.
Those other guys still write songs.
Because of that I knew I was going to beat myself up for not being better.
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Were your expectations for yourself realistic?Well, I dont know.
But the business changed, too.
Albums werent meaning what they used to mean in the marketplace.
I grew up in the era where an album had to be substantial.
It couldnt be throwaway Christmas shit like Elvis used to do.
Then the business changed.
I just had higher expectations for it.
Then the record company came in and said, Okay, whats yournextalbum going to be?
And I went, No, thats it.
You knew you were done 25 years ago?I suppose inherently.
And look, its one thing if you own your recordings.
There was supposed to be areversal of copyrightback to me in 2013.
So I still dont own my recordings.
People wonder why thereve been so many Billy Joellive albums and compilations.Theyre not my idea.
The record company owns all these recordings and can package them any way they want.
As far as Im concerned, I did 12 studio albums.
The live crap and all these compilations they dont mean anything.
And thefirst and second greatest-hits compilation that was my idea.
But after that it was all redundant crap.
Certain composers only have so much productivity in them.
Mozart wrote more than 40 symphonies; Beethoven wrote 9.
That difference doesnt mean one guy was better than the other.
And I always looked at the Beatles as a template.
They did 12 studio albums.
And I was more interested in other music.
The Scrimshaw Pieces?Yeah,The Scrimshaw Pieces.Its thematic, about the history of Long Island.
Its a work in progress.
My understanding is that youve been chipping away at that for 20 years.
If I dont, maybe it wont.
I didnt want anything to do with it.
I refer to that album as Twigs and Stems and Seeds youre not supposed to smoke that shit.
Over my career Ive beensavaged pretty goodand that leaves scar tissue, sure.
Maybe I would have been more productive if Id had an easier time with critics.
When I released that album [Fantasies & Delusions] the classical critics take you apart with a scalpel.
Its a very refined ripping of the skin and bleeding of the arteries.
Those guys are nasty.
But I feel like Im over that now.
The critics didnt scare me off from releasing new material.
I just dont feel compelled to share what Im doing with the world.
Then I said, Stop it.
You dont write songs as an exercise.
You do it for real.
Maybe Im misreading, but it seems as if critics opinions linger with you.
Why do you care?
I would read a review and the critics would go, His stuff is no good.
And Im saying, No, no, no, no.
I thought they were missing it.There was a bad takedown of me a couple years ago.
And that bothered you?It didnt bother me.
I know good music: You cant tell me everything I do is bad.
But some people just have that reaction to my stuff.
I could probably come off obnoxious unless youre from my neighborhood and know how we talk.
He gave me a bad review once and I agreed with it.
I think it was for theStreetlife Serenadealbum.
And Stephen Holdensreviewsaid I had nothing to say.
I go, Busted.
The general consensus on that album was Thats it for Billy Joel.
And I thought,maybe so.
I was probably already thinking about retirement back then.
Do you Google yourself a lot?Oh, no, God.
Its a good thing Google didnt exist in 1978.
That wouldve been painful.
That comparison is understandable but it can also seem like a category error or something.
Did that comparison make sense to you?I remember seeing that kind of review.
A piano player is always suspect because only rich people are supposed to have pianos.
Use too many effects on your recording and its considered artifice; do something stripped-down and its considered real.
But Bruce was also a wordsmith and critics are wordsmiths.
So he had that going for him.
I never resented the good press that Bruce got.
I was just never about the words first.
I wrote the music then the words.
To me, the words sometimes I dont give a fuck.
Or Yes: What the fuck are they talking about?
Do you like Yes?I do.
I opened up for them in 73 or 74.
ButClose to the Edgeis the one.Thats right.
I was with Yes up toTales From Topographic Oceans.Then they lost me.
Whats your best lyric?Probably something onRiver of Dreams.
I like that songNo Mans Land.[Sings.]
Raise up a multiplex and we will make a sacrifice.
This biblical imagery skewed by consumerism Im proud of that.
There are some good lyrics inAll About Soultoo.
I thought I made a quantum leap lyrically on that album.
Was it always easy to zero in on the lyrical themes?Not always.
Ill give you an example: I couldnt writeAllentownfor about three years.
Originally it was called Levittown.
Im living here in Levittown / and there really isnt much around.
The trees are green / the dirt is brown.
The song was not going anywhere.
And that pointed me in the right lyrical direction.
That kid was right, by the way.
To this day, I still feel bad about not playing the Lehigh Valley.
Nothings stopping you.Except the expense.
Is what Springsteen is doing on Broadway something youd consider?No.
How come?I dont want to work five nights a week like he does.
If I feel like singingA Whiter Shade of Pale,I do it.
If someone is in town and wants to come play with us, they can.
The other day I was watching footage ofAxl Rose singing Big Shotwith you at Dodger Stadium.
Im looking at Axl like,Arent you interested in, you know, meeting these women?
No, he just wanted to talk aboutCaptain Jack.
Also, nine people are in the band.
To do smaller rooms Id have to scale down, and I dont want to fire anybody right now.
As it turns out, Russell got let go because he wasnt playing anything.
We isolated his guitar part and played it back and it waspluck, pluck.
So what am I paying this guy for?
And Libertys reasons [for why he no longer plays in Joels band] are wrong.
He said it was financial.
It had nothing to do with money.Absolutely nothing.
Im not going to tell my side of the story.
In retrospect, was that part of things handled too brusquely?Maybe.
WithDoug [Stegmeyer],maybe.
The problem was that there was an impossibility to communicate at one point.
This was during the time I was makingThe Bridge.
The communication got so bad.
Because he kept getting paid.
So what is he complaining about?
I was loyal to him for 30 years; he got paid by me for 30 years.
So Ive been lucky with people.
But I remember the show at the Garden after the Charlottesville riot when you wore a Star of David.
How do you decide when you want to make your beliefs known?
To me, what happened in Charlottesville was like war.
When Trump said there were good people on both sides there are no good Nazis.
There are no good Ku Klux Klan people.
Dont equivocate that shit.
He risked his life in Europe to defeat Nazism.
A lot of men from his generation did the same thing.
Those creeps are going to march through the streets ofmycountry?Uh-uh.
I was personally offended.
Thats why I wore that yellow star.
I had to do something, and I didnt think speaking about it was going to be as impactful.
But right now I can specifically look to our leader and blame it on him.
We have a terrible president.
We have a terrible administration.
Politically, Im not happy where our country is.
These children are being ripped away from their parents and then the U.S. cant find them?
This is the antithesis of America.
I think well look back in shame on whats happening at the border right now.
Its like when they rounded up the Japanese and threw em in camps during the war.
I mean, Im doing a fundraiser for [Andrew] Cuomo.
I get crap for that already, people saying Im a Long Island libtard.
I dont know; it seems like everybodys conservative nowadays.
When I was a teenager, we were all protesting the war and now everybody is right wing.
I just think right now there are a lot of people who are misguided in their politics.
It used to be that the working man would have been a socialist-leaning Roosevelt voter.
Now Trump is where they look for relief, which I think is a mistake.
But Im not so absolutist that I think,My opinion is the correct opinion.
Maybe Im wrong about things.
Youve met Trump, right?I was invited to his wedding [to Melania Trump].
This is when I was married toKatie, my third wife.She wanted to go.
I thought it would be an interesting freak show.
I dont even know Trump.
Then why were you invited?I have no idea.
I guess he was just inviting A-listers.
I dont remember anything about the wedding.
I remember maybe talking to Chris Matthews.
Is drinking ever a problem anymore?No.
I used to drink too much I guess it was a form of self-medicating.
Drinking was one of the reasons I stopped writing songs.
I would drink to try and ease the pain of not being as good as I wanted to be.
I would even try Dutch courage:How am I going to write?
Let me have a drink and fool myself into thinking I can write while Im drunk.
It was a vicious cycle, so I stopped.
I didnt want to be one of those authors like Hemingway who offs themselves because they drink too much.
My wife listens to pop music on the radio and thats the most exposure I have.
Do you like what you hear?Sometimes.I like the Killers.
Theyre a good rock band.
But I dont listen to pop or rock and roll anymore.
Even classic rock?I only listen to classical music.
I dont seek it out.
Lets put it that way.
But the old stuff.
Does it …Have resonance?
Yeah, Ill take out a CD and play Cream or Hendrix or Zeppelin.
I still get thrilled listening to the Beatles and the Stones.
I do think Piano Man couldve been better.
There was actually Paul, in real estate, and the guy was writing a novel.
I used the real peoples names in the song.
I suppose its hard for some people to believe that.
If I could make about a quarter of what I wrote disappear, I wouldnt be unhappy.
By the time this interview is published, youll have played your 100th show at the Garden.
What does that number mean to you?Its beyond gobsmacking.
And I think ofallthe shows Ive done: Who was that guy always on the road?
He was so ambitious.
I only do two gigs a month now.
I was looking at your stuff on Spotify and was surprised to see thatViennawas in your top-five most-streamed songs.
That song was never a hit.
Howd it turn into such a favorite?It took a good 15 to 20 years.
Beyond that, Im not sure.
Its a coming-of-age song: Slow down you crazy child.
So I guess it resonates with younger people.
Its a fun one to play.
My bar was Beethoven.
Easy enough.[Laughs.
I read that and went, Thats my problem: I havent.
But I did the best I could.
I dont think I coasted.
There are artists who continue to record because they feel like thats what keeps them relevant.
But if the quality of their work deteriorates it drags down the entire catalogue.
Elton [John] would say to me, Why dont you put out more albums?
I would say, Why dont you put out less albums?
I didnt want to come out and say, Youre dragging down your legacy.
I imagine every legacy artist approaches the new output question differently.People feel compelled.
Paul McCartney, to this day: Gotta be relevant.
Gotta be new.
Gotta have a hit.
I stopped feeling like that a long time ago.
How often have you been approached about doing a new album?Its happened.
Whos the guy who produced those Johnny Cash records?
Rick Rubin.Yeah, he wanted to do something bring me back to my roots.
Didnt appeal to me.
AndClive Davis, when he was at Columbia, said, Why dont you cover the great classic-rock songs?
I think he meant [Barry] Manilow stuff but I said, Okay, you mean Led Zeppelin?
He didnt like that idea.
Kashmir wouldve been pretty great to cover.
Thats a gorgeous song.
No one ever asked you to do a standards album?Rod Stewart has that covered pretty well.
But yeah, from time to time theres been suggestions: Why dont you do this?
Why dont you do that?
I have an idea for you.Yeah?
Attila Two.Thatd blow minds.Its true that nobody is expecting myMetal Machine Musicand probably nobody needs it.
It was more that I admired people.
Someone likeRandy Newman, for example, is fucking brilliant.
That early Americana feel he used had an impact on me.
Paul Simon, too, with the folk elements in his music.
I was even motivated by James Brown.
Whats that album,An Innocent Man?The first track, what is it?
Easy Money.Thats more Wilson Pickett, actually.
I wanted to do a Wilson Pickett track.
But it wasnt about trying to best anyone.
It was about trying to get their vibe.
Ive never had a style in particular, and it never bothered me.
It bothered other people:Hes in a stylistic no-mans land.
That allows me to write any which way I want.
Which of your peers are underrated?Randy Newman was underrated.
Jeez, who else?
I keep getting, He doesnt challenge the audience enough.
No, they need more challenging.
I dont buy that.
It amazes me that you keep coming back to criticisms.
Can I just tell you: Youve written a ton of great songs.
A huge number of fans love what you do.
Yourplace in the cultureis secure.
You dont need to worry about any criticisms anymore.I dont worry about it.
Seems like it rankles.But criticism was a motivator for me.It was like, No, youre wrong.
His life was troubled.
If anybody was depressed, he was.
And he died in a bad way he was ill for a long time.
He was probably unable to feel joy for his children.
Is it right that when you were a kid he told you life is a cesspool?Yeah.
Whats the context in which someone says that to a child?You got me.
I dont think hearing that colored my perspective but it did stick with me.
I didnt know what a cesspool was.
I just knew it was scary.
Its sad my old man got the shaft from life.
His father was rich, and the Nazis took it all away.
Then he had a kid who got rich and he couldnt enjoy that either because he was too sick.
My dad had tough times.
It was like, $40,000 or $50,000 a lot of money but worth it.
And there was a tax benefit because it was a work expense.
Actually, being able to afford a good accountant is also a great luxury.
I learned that the hard way.
Ive had times in my life where I was sad but I never stayed there.
You did write about being depressed a fair bit, though.
I dont carry grudges.
I get on with my life.
Im a happy-go-lucky guy.
This interview has been edited and condensed from two conversations.
Photo: J. Kempin/Getty Images
